Curse

MrFuzzles · Jul 04, 2007, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by thor hammerbane

these get to me the most.

You know what gets me the most? People who stick around for the 10 wins in RA, and leave after the 10th victory.

"Woah guys, okay we dominated random arena but I heard a rumor that team arena might be challenging, good luck guys I'm out!"

I don't care if they leave before or after the 11th match starts. It's just a matter of principle. It just confirms that so many people will settle for nothing less than free wins.

It's fair that 10 matches takes a few minutes and sometimes you just don't have the time to stick around, but I'd hardly chalk that up as the reason for everyone who does this.

I'm pretty close to the first gladiator title, and I can count on one hand the times the team has stuck around for the 11'th match. In one of those cases, we went on to get 36 wins and I left because we were all getting bored.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shendaar

at least one retard that you know will suck just by his choice of profession(almost every x/R player).

So.. what... If I make a pure necro build and just happen to put /R as my secondary (maybe I was *considering* a stance or nature ritual), will you leave if you end up in a team with me?

What is a pro secondary I can set so I'm less likely to get leavers?

Shendaar · Jul 04, 2007, 03:28 PM // 15:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrFuzzles

So.. what... If I make a pure necro build and just happen to put /R as my secondary (maybe I was *considering* a stance or nature ritual), will you leave if you end up in a team with me?

What is a pro secondary I can set so I'm less likely to get leavers?

Notice that I said "most" for a reason. And I wouldn't leave even if all my was /r so long as I get to have a healer.

MrFuzzles · Jul 04, 2007, 03:41 PM // 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navaros

there really is no point whatsoever to RA other than getting Glad points.

But what's the point in glad titles? Why is your glad point more important than other people's desire to just play RA?

Really, I'm not trying to flame or anything like that. I honestly do want to know, since I play GW *because* it has less of a grind element to it than other mmo's, *because* I can log on, play some random pvp matches for a few minutes, and log off again, no strings attached. Yet, it seems that all everyone wants to do is to grind whatever there is to grind - no matter what it is - even if it's something cosmetic and miniscule as text under your name.
Aren't there better rewards to be farmed in other mmo's like Lineage 2 or Eve or something?

Shendaar · Jul 04, 2007, 04:15 PM // 16:15

People like to have a goal and some have a different vision of what is fun and what isn't. Maybe for you it is fun to get a randomly generate crap team and lose with it ... it stopped being fun for me a year ago. I don't consider the glad title a grind, has it is not necessary in any way. The glad title is merely a personal goal that just so happens to justify going in RA.

Lord Natural · Jul 04, 2007, 04:40 PM // 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrFuzzles

I'm pretty close to the first gladiator title, and I can count on one hand the times the team has stuck around for the 11'th match. In one of those cases, we went on to get 36 wins and I left because we were all getting bored.

Multiply your gladiator points (and time spent in ra) by about 10, and you will get a better appreciation of what builds work and what don't. People leave after 10 for the same reason they leave if the team looks bad. For these players it's all about efficiency. If you know a team lacks the proper build or the skill to have a legitimate shot in TA, then staying is simply wasting time that could be spent starting a new run in RA. From having experience in both RA and TA, I can usually peg whether a streaking RA team has a reasonable shot at continuing successfully in TA. Some do, most don't. I sometimes base whether I stay after 10 or not on this, though if the team has been friendly I'll stick around anyway, more often than not.

I was like you once in that I also detested leavers with a passion, but pursuing the gladiator track long enough is enough to make anyone jaded. I'm not saying that it's right, but it is a fact. After spending that much time focused on a goal, you just won't want to play with the worst of the worst, even if you're just testing a build. I'm not saying RA is simply a grind and that it's no fun for me, because that's not true at all. I really enjoy playing a lot of different builds and using RA as a means to practice, as well as pursue a title track. But after all this time, I've just run out of patience for those out to grief, or those who purchased the game like a week ago.

Don't get me wrong, I used to love playing with no healer, beat-down groups who could get to 10 through pure offense. But while those teams were common in the Proph days, they are all but a thing of the past now, and I don't mean because of leavers. The game just isn't balanced like it once was, and even the strongest of beat-down groups will usually face their counter before 10. I can count on one hand the number of glad points I've gotten with no healer at all over the past 6 months, whereas in the Proph days I'd say no less than 1/4 of my 10 win streaks would come with no form of healer. For those after a title, this is probably a justification in itself for seeking a monk before actually playing. I've had too many blitz groups stifled by some trash like a spirit shitter to take no healer groups too seriously anymore.

glountz · Jul 04, 2007, 04:49 PM // 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shendaar

People like to have a goal and some have a different vision of what is fun and what isn't. Maybe for you it is fun to get a randomly generate crap team and lose with it ... it stopped being fun for me a year ago. I don't consider the glad title a grind, has it is not necessary in any way. The glad title is merely a personal goal that just so happens to justify going in RA.

You're just another selfish jerk leaver.
The current PvP is completely rotten, from RA to GvG, by this selfish farming attitude. It was before restricted to HA, which has, as I remember, always been rottent to death through rank farming (from IWay to Rit spike).
Before glad points, RA and TA were the only places to relax and have PvP fun without griefers and selfish 12 yrs old farmers.
I lol too to people that say "I can do it so it's not bad". You know, you can kill your neighbor, rape his wife and sell his children as slaves to make some money. No problem. Some people don't do it because that's selfish. But most people don't do it because it is severely punished by law, and if it was auhorized, would quite d othat everyday.
You, leavers, have always been in this punished/authorized attitudes. For you , what's morally acceptable is what is not punished, what's not is what is punished. This is a childish behavior created by parental education, who learn the moral codes to their children by the punishment/reward system. I suspect most leavers are kids acting the same way (no punishment=authorized). But some people never learn the why and keep this behaviour during their lifetime.
That's why we need punishment, to learn to people whith lack of conscience what's good or not.
Leaving is not good because you doom completely your team. Most of them were here to have and relax and not to farm glads, but you don't care being selfish, you waste their time (which is to fight, to improve their skills, to test new builds, not to farm glads) by trying to keep yours. So you actually think that your time is more valuable than theirs, which is not.
In real life, a ciminal act the same way, they only consider their benefits, not the harm they can do to other's.
Punishment systems have been implemented in other games and works wonder. It should be implemented here to keep the community clean.
Rank title is what destroyed completely destroyed HA, by letting farm and grind enter in PvP. A simple ladder would have been so much better.
Then they implemented this rotten aspect of the game everywhere, from PVE to even the starting ground of PvP: RA.

Frantic-Sheep · Jul 04, 2007, 05:08 PM // 17:08

The annoying part is that most of the times they dont even KNOW how the team performs. I had glad points without monks, and I'm sure many of you had. You dont *need* a monk (but it sure can make things easier). Supporting Rts, Emo's etc. can do a fine job in RA, ffs its RA.

Its the leaving before the match even started thats just annoying. If you leave after 50% wipes under 30 seconds.. I dont blame people. If you leave without the doors being open, thats just ghey imo.

glountz · Jul 04, 2007, 05:17 PM // 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Natural

Don't get me wrong, I used to love playing with no healer, beat-down groups who could get to 10 through pure offense. But while those teams were common in the Proph days, they are all but a thing of the past now, and I don't mean because of leavers. The game just isn't balanced like it once was, and even the strongest of beat-down groups will usually face their counter before 10. I can count on one hand the number of glad points I've gotten with no healer at all over the past 6 months, whereas in the Proph days I'd say no less than 1/4 of my 10 win streaks would come with no form of healer. For those after a title, this is probably a justification in itself for seeking a monk before actually playing. I've had too many blitz groups stifled by some trash like a spirit shitter to take no healer groups too seriously anymore.

You don't seem to have read th whole thread. There's a PvP place, not far from RA, where you can be with skilled people, controlled build and team composition. And you know what ? You can have glad points here. That's called TA.
You want perfect team and build? Go there.

You don't because you're an antisocial with no friends to play with, or simply because you're not good enough to face the opposition in TA.
So, instead of improving your skills/builds, you mess up other people's time, by leaving, or you need to have an unfair advantage to compensate your lack of skill, by synching.

No matter the way you can turn it, you're just being a selfish guy.

I really could understand your point of view, seriously, if RA were the only place to farm glads. Like people leaving teams in Wintersday's arenas because they were with unskilled kiddies.
But there, you have TA. And still you waste other's people time.
Sorry, but no.

Zaelen · Jul 04, 2007, 05:26 PM // 17:26

Quick RA fix -

If you leave before 1:00 mark, RA queue disabled. If you disconnect and cannot reconnect, being unable to requeue is hardly of concern.

After 10:00, sudden death. If one team has more alive members than the other, that team wins.

kvndoom · Jul 04, 2007, 06:36 PM // 18:36

It is frustrating. Sometimes I feel forced to play certain builds just to be able to spend more time playing than zoning. I mean, if you play a healer, people don't leave. And yeah I get a lot of points as a healer. But when I actually feel like killing something, it's a nonstop stream of "... has left the game." if there's no healer. Sometimes the monks, who seem to think they are gods, judge the team before the match starts and leave anyway. I've won 10 or more with some of the most ragtag off the wall players on my team that you could imagine. The big problem is not giving your team a chance. Play one match, if you win but they suck, so be it, go and leave. But if you give the team a chance, you might be surprised.

And Glountz couldn't be more right. If you want a TA-quality team, go to TA. I won't even sync with my own guildies because we could do TA if we wanted to guarantee being on the same team.

I'd like to see leavers (who bail before the gate even opens) get some kind of timeout, or gladiator points removed from RA altogether. I've said so many times, Anet never should have given RA and TA the same title.

Yaga Philipe · Jul 04, 2007, 06:53 PM // 18:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muspellsheimr

First, there are already at least one or two RECENT threads with this idea, but as the search sucks, I can see starting a new thread.
Also, you posted this thread multiple times - try not doing that again.

A better overall setup than "10-20 minutes" would be something along the lines of:

Leave before match has begun (during timer) - 15 minute temp-ban
Leave within the first 5 minutes of the match - 10 minute temp-ban
Leave between the 5 minute and 20 minute mark - 5 minute temp-ban

Resign incurs no penalty.
Leaving after 20 minutes incurs no penalty.
Second person on a team to leave receives 75% penalty.
Third and fourth leavers incur no penalty.

Time frames can be adjusted to fit better, but this setup would allow for minimal/no penalty for greatly extended games, and leaving if half your team has already left. Also, resigning incurs no penalty in case your team has a poor setup (4 monks).

I like that, very good idea right there.

MrTickle · Jul 05, 2007, 01:01 AM // 01:01

It's because of leavers that I've never gotten more than 2 wins in a row. I've been trying for a couple of months on & off (mostly off thanks to selfish quitters) but cannot progress past RA.

thor hammerbane · Jul 05, 2007, 01:08 AM // 01:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shendaar

The build is barely relevant. Unless you have a very strong team with tons of shutdown or have a good rit, you have literally no chance of getting a glad point. Beside, how the hell do you test the effectiveness of a build without some proper healing support? Do you solo often in GW(farming aside)??? I only RA in my spare time and I do it get glad points and a bit of fun like many others. There is no way I would get a glad point with no monk and most likely at least one retard that you know will suck just by his choice of profession(almost every x/R player).

Your wrong on this one. Out of the 20 or so glad points I recently collected, About 5-6 Were with a healer, The rest with builds with alot of damage/shutdown. I'm not saying you have to make a wammo build for randoms, I'm simply saying don't ragequit because there isn't a monk. Some people think it's absolutely necessary to have a monk to succeed, but like I said, that's not true. All my randoms builds either have no self healing, or some basic self healing (Ether feast on a mesmer, Lions Comfort on a warrior) but yet I've still been successful many times without a monk. People just need to realize that a monk isn't always needed.

Nuclfus · Jul 05, 2007, 01:18 AM // 01:18

If you're leaving because real life calls, a 20 minute ban won't hurt you. If you're leaving to get a "better" group, then you're the lousy player who's screwing over your teammates and odds are you'll only end up doing it again to your next team anyway. A 20 minute ban will help save other groups the trouble of having to put up with noobs like you.

6am3 Fana71c · Jul 05, 2007, 01:44 AM // 01:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shendaar

Cry me a river. You are comparing the situation to a criminal act .... You just destroyed all your credibility. Sad. And of course I consider my time to be more valuable ... it is my time after all. Anyway, you can go lose if you want, I'll go "grind" aka win and improve my skills as a team player with non-crippled builds on my end. Good luck.

He didn't destroyed his credibility at all, you just showed everyone you are one of those fu*kin leavers who think that earth revolves around them so they can go ahead and screw other people for their own selfish reasons. Grow up, will ya? You won't improve anything by leaving, you will only leave and leave and leave untill you find a group that will do your work instead of you. If you are so hot go and play TA, but wait, I know... Your ass would be smoked in a matter of seconds there. God, I'm sick of people like you. Fu*king parasites.

Lord Natural · Jul 05, 2007, 01:46 AM // 01:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by glountz

You don't seem to have read th whole thread. There's a PvP place, not far from RA, where you can be with skilled people, controlled build and team composition. And you know what ? You can have glad points here. That's called TA.
You want perfect team and build? Go there.

If you'd read my post, you'd have seen the part where I mention that TA is a dead arena with a pitiful reward system. I still do it (rarely) when enough people are on and in the mood, but, going back to the reward system, if I have people online wanting to form a group, why not go somewhere with a purpose (HA/GvG). I go to RA when there's no one around to do anything else. That's exactly the point. If people are around, why would you want to do something you can do just as easily on your own - Namely, casually work on the gladiator title track.

Quote:

You don't because you're an antisocial with no friends to play with, or simply because you're not good enough to face the opposition in TA.
So, instead of improving your skills/builds, you mess up other people's time, by leaving

Now you're starting to cry like the mending wammo everyone leaves immediately. Judging by your comments, I most likely have 5x your arena experience. I have nothing left to learn in RA. That's not a conceit, it's just a fact. After so many hours of pvp, you learn the game's mechanics. I play RA when I'm bored, that is all. Your opinion of me is irrelevant. I don't know you, nor do I wish to.

Quote:

you need to have an unfair advantage to compensate your lack of skill, by synching

I never mentioned synching in my post.

Quote:

No matter the way you can turn it, you're just being a selfish guy.

I really could understand your point of view, seriously, if RA were the only place to farm glads. Like people leaving teams in Wintersday's arenas because they were with unskilled kiddies.
But there, you have TA. And still you waste other's people time.
Sorry, but no.

Playing in ID, almost every single team I get without a monk has at least one leaver. This doesn't bother me. Why should it? If I'm playing PvP I want to win, no matter what form of PvP it is. I've already stated that it's highly improbable to win/get glad points with a monkless team post-proph. Doesn't everyone who plays RA play to win? How is it being selfish for everyone to cycle enter battle again? Takes 10 seconds and gives everyone a chance at a better team. If I get a bad team, I'll cycle a few times. If I keep getting bad teams, I'll monk. What is there to get so raged about?

Shendaar · Jul 05, 2007, 02:18 AM // 02:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6am3 Fana71c

He didn't destroyed his credibility at all, you just showed everyone you are one of those fu*kin leavers who think that earth revolves around them so they can go ahead and screw other people for their own selfish reasons. Grow up, will ya? You won't improve anything by leaving, you will only leave and leave and leave untill you find a group that will do your work instead of you. If you are so hot go and play TA, but wait, I know... Your ass would be smoked in a matter of seconds there. God, I'm sick of people like you. Fu*king parasites.

More crying please. I also don't improve by losing because we have no healing support. Your argument is trash ... Not that you have any beside personal attacks, so I don't know why I am wasting my time with you.

glountz · Jul 05, 2007, 09:24 AM // 09:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shendaar

More crying please. I also don't improve by losing because we have no healing support. Your argument is trash ... Not that you have any beside personal attacks, so I don't know why I am wasting my time with you.

And you think you made a valid point here? Your counter argument is what : "You argument is trash"?
Bah.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shendaar

Cry me a river. You are comparing the situation to a criminal act .... You just destroyed all your credibility. Sad. And of course I consider my time to be more valuable ... it is my time after all. Anyway, you can go lose if you want, I'll go "grind" aka win and improve my skills as a team player with non-crippled builds on my end. Good luck.

My point is perfectly relevant. If you're not enough clever to understand it, you can't be helped. That's a online game with internet anonymousity. That's why you can act (and act) like a selfish jerk, ruining other's fun to have yours, without any repercussions. Only punishment can stop people like you. Because that's the way you (and most leavers) react, as most criminals react in real life.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Natural

Playing in ID, almost every single team I get without a monk has at least one leaver. This doesn't bother me. Why should it? If I'm playing PvP I want to win, no matter what form of PvP it is. I've already stated that it's highly improbable to win/get glad points with a monkless team post-proph. Doesn't everyone who plays RA play to win? How is it being selfish for everyone to cycle enter battle again? Takes 10 seconds and gives everyone a chance at a better team. If I get a bad team, I'll cycle a few times. If I keep getting bad teams, I'll monk. What is there to get so raged about?

Leaving before timer starts shows that you're completely unable to do something without relying on other people (here, a monk). I would had that a monk is not required to win, it's a good monk that will ensure you victory. I've had my fair share of healing/smite monks, thanks.
If you don't know how to mitigate damage, to avoid simple errors like say, stopping bashing when multi-hexed, hide behind rocks to avoid ranged attacks as a caster, kite and prekite, don't overextend outside rez/healing/disruption range etc.. Yes you will fail with no monk. Of course.
If you have no monk, you also have more offense or disruption or support (potentially). By clever play, you can, like, if you face mes/necros and you are a warrior, draw the attention and all the hexes and do nothing excepted to heal yourself and strike a little while your teamates bash away the casters.
Don't be fooled, I have left my fair part of teams. But always at the end of the fight. Leaving at the beginning is incredibly selfish. You don't even let a chance to the team. And I left my fair part of monked teams, where the monk was clearly a very bad one, unable to stand against a single sin spike.
If people has two-three monks, there's a command called /resign you can use.
I can't remember the number of times I earned glad points with no monks (especially playing rits).
On the play to win thing, sorry, but farming glad points is not "playing to win". That's like in HA. People "playing to win" hold halls. People farming rank points farm scrubs because they can't hope holding halls. Like you in RA, that's the exact and same behavior. People with the "playing to win" credo actually go in TA. To improve their skills and strategy against the best TA guilds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Natural

Now you're starting to cry like the mending wammo everyone leaves immediately. Judging by your comments, I most likely have 5x your arena experience. I have nothing left to learn in RA. That's not a conceit, it's just a fact. After so many hours of pvp, you learn the game's mechanics. I play RA when I'm bored, that is all. Your opinion of me is irrelevant. I don't know you, nor do I wish to.

1) You didn't answer to my point that in TA you have all you want that makes you leaving in RA because it lacks: controlled team, builds, and player skills.
2) You have nothing left to learn in RA? oh! Why don't you try TA?
3) Because it's a dead PvP zone with no reward? Sorry the reward is exactly the same than in RA. The issue is that you've not enough friends or skill to play in. If you were [Eat] you would have earned your glad points there. I would also mention that by leaving in RA, you're also contributing to make this place rotten and a dead one.
4) Judging by your comments, and your unability to make valid points ("that's not a conceit, that's a fact") I have 98745^99 times your experience in MMO games all over the world (p=0.05). Wow, you see, i can talk like you.

I'm beginning to be sick with this thread.
I don't RA so much, especially because of jerks like you making this place rotten.
Now, only GvG (and still....) is relatively farm/grind free... And yet, most GvGers would disagree with me.
Remove PvP titles, or punish grind/farming behavior in PvP. That's all I ask for PvP.
Ladder is quite the best thing to enhance and promote PvP fair competition. I can't understand A-net put one on Hero Battles and not for TA.

Cass · Jul 05, 2007, 10:05 AM // 10:05

Just wanted to point out that going TA is not the answer. There you need to find a party, coordinate build into detail and get on voice comm. A lot of effort.

In RA it's click and enter. Easy, effortless. Also, as I said before, a reasonable leaver will not leave every team that doesn't fit his narrow ideal template. I highly doubt anyone does actually, as you would never get to play a game. Also, keep in mind that the template here is professions... not even skills. When I say you need healing, for example, that could come from anything ranging from an E/Mo to a Healing breezer to a paragon. But *some* is needed, and more than what ether feast can provide. This is not a "mindset" as someone blatantly stated, it's what I've learned during PvPing. And I've done quite a bit of that.

Cass · Jul 05, 2007, 11:21 AM // 11:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrFuzzles

I still think the whole "obviously there's no point in playing if I can't win/can't get a glad point" mentality is extremely disappointing. This has really started to turn me off pvp.

LOL Hello? This is a competitive game mode by definition. Winning is kind of the goal of a competition.

In any case, there is nobody stopping you from valiantly fighting 3vs4. Nobody. Oh, but you want support from SOMEone, no matter how inept, no matter how chanceless your team is. There MUST be four. Why? ... To win? Or so that all four suffer the defeat? Check yourself.